Author Topic: The Euro has brought us Stability  (Read 2880 times)

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Z

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The Euro has brought us Stability
« on: September 26, 2012, 20:01:37 PM »
has it really ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gm9q8uabTs

Offline vikilein

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Re: The Euro has brought us Stability
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2012, 15:08:22 PM »
Dear Z,
After watching this video, I have to say that I strongly disagree with the points made by Mr Farage. First of all, your video is over 2 years old – surely you must realize that the situation has changed quite a lot since then and consequently many of the points made in this video are obsolete. The world of economy is about as fast moving as it gets; therefore if you want to discuss the economy you should always make sure your material is still up to date (which a two years old video can hardly be considered). Moreover, Nigel Farage doesn’t focus on facts, but instead emotionalises and polemicises the topic. This may be a common and popular method for winning electoral votes – but when speaking in Parliament, where the aim is (or should be) to find solutions for the problems we are facing, a politician should certainly focus on facts and arguments. Politics should be argued over with reason and common sense, while it should be avoided to involve emotions in the matter (while this is probably not entirely possible, it should at least be the aim).
Furthermore, there is no way any country is going to get out of the crisis on its own. We have slipped into this crisis together and gradually – the reasons are much more complex than Mr Farage makes them appear to be, and while the EU is not flawless, the crisis cannot be entirely put down to the European Union as the “root of all evil”, as some people seem to believe. The end of the housing boom in Ireland, the corruption in Greece – can you really blame the EU for that? Some might argue that the EU is to blame for the bankruptcy of countries like Greece because the politicians there would be more motivated to tend to the problems in their country if they didn’t know that the EU will bail them out if they go broke. This might be true to some extent, but still this affects the politics of a country only indirectly. If the politicians in a country are incapable of dealing with the crisis, then it’s their own fault – the EU can affect this only indirectly. The effect which it can have is much weaker than we are made to believe by anti-EU populists. Also the EU didn’t have any instruments to take influence on the banks – it’s not the EUs fault that they had so many bad credits.
Should we really stop supporting those countries all of a sudden, stop working together, should we stop the “System Euro” – it would effectively be a disaster, not only for the countries that are struggling with the danger of going bust. It would be a disaster for many other countries in which the investors still trust for but one reason – namely, because of the support this community can give them. Disastrous knock-on effects would ensue - all that would crash and burn and soon we would see many other countries struggling with the looming bankruptcy.
Last but not least I would like to comment on a different matter which is not connected with economy; in the end of the video he speaks about the dangers of nationalism. Having quickly checked the Wikipedia article about both Mr Farage and his party UKIP before writing this post, I found this: “UKIP states that Britain and Britishness have been "betrayed by misguided politically correct ideology, extremist Islam and errant nationalism from within", that "Britain is a proud nation state, which does not wish its identity to be diluted or trivialised... and feel it is time to assert our independence, identity and traditions." Hearing the leader of a party which makes such a statement talk about the dangers of nationalism is somewhere between absurd and grotesque, in my humble opinion.

Offline Riney

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Re: The Euro has brought us Stability
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2012, 17:09:21 PM »
Wow- this is interesting. I unfortunately know next to nothing about European politics. But I am certainly glad to see this debate going on- I may very well learn more about politics in Europe through this thread than I did the whole 3 plus years I lived there.  8)   
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

rote zora

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Re: The Euro has brought us Stability
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2012, 00:27:00 AM »
Hi vikilein,

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First of all, your video is over 2 years old – surely you must realize that the situation has changed quite a lot since then and consequently many of the points made in this video are obsolete.

The situation has changed indeed quite a lot: it's gone from bad to worse and the points made in the video (dismantling democracy, unemployment, state debts etc.) are still an issue today as they were then.

It gets better, Farage even predicted which countries would be next in line to apply for financial support which highlights the basic problem of forcing a shared currency on countries that aren’t prepared to participate in the Eurozone.  Having stated this, it must be said that it is virtually impossible to force different national economies to share the same currency, the reason being that countries experiencing economic depression wouldn’t have the possibility to devalue the shared currency. 

A prime example would be Greece which could solved many of its problems if they had the chance to devalue their own currency (drachma ) which would stimulate national economy.

The ONLY alternative to a devaluation of the currency would be an internal devaluation. This means, enhancement of competitiveness could also be achieved by declining wages, rising taxes and massive cuts in public spending as already implemented in Greece, Spain and Portugal which is unfair on the general population.

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Global economy is about as fast moving as it gets; therefore if you want to discuss the economy you should always make sure your material is still up to date (which a two years old video can hardly be considered)…The end of the housing boom in Ireland, the corruption in Greece – can you really blame the EU for that?

Your examples (corruption in Greece, housing boom in Ireland - which btw. was caused by low interest rates in Germany) are purely the result of failed monetary and economical policies. Crises come and go, they just get renamed, but are caused by the same root problem.  If you want to know more about this issue, then google Argentina adoption of the dollar or even better follow this link:

http://modernmoney.wordpress.com/2011/01/31/argentina-inflation-due-to-pegged%C2%A0currency/

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Moreover, Nigel Farage doesn’t focus on facts, but instead emotionalises and polemicises the topic.

Is he really worse than all the eurocratic drama queens who do nothing else, but talk about STABILITY and make WET PROMISES?
Please just watch the video. It’s only a few days old:
http://politica.elpais.com/politica/2012/09/25/videos/1348601224_973288.html

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This may be a common and popular method for winning electoral votes.
"It’s not about making more debts, but it’s more about preventing countries like Greece, Portugal, Spain and other from pensioning their workers at an earlier age than in Germany and all working hard to achieve this.” - Angela Merkel

What do you think about this statement? Isn’t that popular method for winning electoral votes in Germany? Merkel is manipulating the German voters. She already knows that most people in Greece enter their pension age at an later date than in Germany. Isn’t this populist and in first line dangerous?

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Should we really stop supporting those countries all of a sudden, stop working together, should we stop the “System Euro”.

We can only support these countries and their work force if we STOP the “System Euro”.

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“UKIP states that Britain and Britishness have been "betrayed by misguided politically correct ideology, extremist Islam and errant nationalism from within".

In my opinion he’s just critizing all extremist groups, EVEN nationalists from within.

« Last Edit: September 29, 2012, 00:34:06 AM by rote zora »