Author Topic: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?  (Read 9374 times)

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Offline Riney

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2012, 17:44:57 PM »
     Well now people are tweeting that WikiLeaks supporters should use the "write in a name option" to cast their ballots on election day- to vote for WikiLeaks or Julian Assange as president of the US it is not clear. Both choices would effectively make that voters ballot invalid, giving only more power to the votes that are valid. Even someone that is a conscientious objector should at least write in their valid third party alternatives and not throw their vote away so completely.
     Then another tweeter is putting out tweets saying that now WikiLeaks has entered the US elections and given people an alternative, by offering a new idea of why someone should donate to WikiLeaks I guess. Donating to WikiLeaks has always been an option for anybodies personal need to support them monetarily.
      Still trying to wrap my head around this.... :-\       
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

Offline Pond

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2012, 17:57:27 PM »
Riney yes!

In Italy the non-valid votes and the non-votes make the majority stronger: is it so also in the US?

Voting is a Civil Right I would never renounce to that thing, even if I perfeclty know that may be Romney vs Obama is not that "real choice", something that can really change things that are bigger than the Presidents themselves... Ooh how much had we [the humanity] got to fight to Conquer the right of voting for all the citiziens?! There are countries where Not all the citiziens can vote by the way, I wouldn't "spite" on the vote so much.

Lol about certain tweets - I'll try to focus on WL twets (or fb posts, it's the same stuff) only, as they are "official", because certain comments by supporters are at least wierd (Assange or WikiLeaks aren't for sure possible candidates in the US - max. in Australia ...) and agree, Riney, I don't see how WL political move could offer more opportunities in the US.
Only the good neutral Information in my opinion can.

Offline Riney

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2012, 18:06:46 PM »
    Those are good points you bring up Hamster- <3

   The one thing I want to speak to is Assange running for the Australian Senate- "as his campaign could possibily be based on setting the country free of US lead manipulations". I have to wonder why he thought that he could turn that habit around. Throughout the world, governments always play back and forth to each other trying to get what each other wants out of the other. The US and Australia are no exception and there is no doubt things between those two countries in the past might have been swayed to the US advantage in some way. But the portrayal that the entire Australian government is completely under the thumb of the US government is a little over blown.
   Also, I always thought it was a little weird that Julian Assange would want to move into an actual elected officials seat. The way politicians lives are completely displayed to the general public would not suit him, he is always so completely adamant that his private life be completely private. Ok, yes I know he fears for his children lives but it goes further than that. He also goes against just about every book ever written about him when it talks about his private life. In politics, a persons life is never private while they are in office, never, there are teams of fact finders that are hired privately by campaign organizers to specifically find out opposition dirty facts and use them against people.         
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

rote zora

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2012, 19:22:52 PM »
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@WikiLeaks - This election don't vote for Obama or Romney just to get the same broken promises. Hold power to account and #voteWL | http://bit.ly/donate2012TWT

https://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/253480541763022848

Not that I believe that this bizarre (and perhaps desperate) action would have any greater impact on the election outcome or bring WL and Assange much more money, but I still have to ask myself what does Assange think who will most likely follow WL call for election boycott. Republican or Democrat voters? Either those who are, for instance, supporting higher military spending or who are against it? More precisely: Romney's or Obama's voters? What is the most represented political attitude among WL supporters? Of course, these are only rethorical questions...




Offline sheaton

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2012, 19:34:33 PM »
Well the message is very clear: ASSANGE ORDERS ALL US VOTERS WHO WISH TO USE THEIR DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS TO VOTE FOR A NEW GOVERNMENT NOT TO VOTE AT ALL AND DONATE THEIR HARD EARNED CASH TO ASSANGE  So yes, please whip out your credit cards and join the ranks of everyone else who gave Assange their money and got screwed over ( Jemima Khan, Ken Loach, John Pilger, Captain Vaughan Smith etc etc )

Also, don't think for a minute that Romney supporters will be influenced by Assange's call to boycott the election. IF Romney wins this election then Assange will learn the true meaning of being on the wrong side of a " witch hunt ", the middle east will go up in flames and there really won't be much left of the " Arab Spring " he claims to have initiated.

Any attempt to boycott the US presidential election will result in a living nightmare for Assange and his organization.



Offline Riney

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #20 on: October 03, 2012, 19:39:27 PM »
Assange/WikiLeaks supporters are more represented by Democrates if I was going to choose between Republican versus Democrates. But to find any party that would be an admitted supporter, you would have to look at third party alternative candidates.
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

rote zora

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #21 on: October 03, 2012, 19:45:50 PM »
@ Riney

Exactly. That's the point I was trying to make: If WL supporters are to follow this call, then the losing party would be most probably the Democrats and WL/Assange must be aware of the situation.

Offline Riney

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #22 on: October 03, 2012, 20:01:29 PM »
@rote zora
   
    Quite frankly at this point, I am not sure what WL/Assange are aware of when it comes to US politics.  :-\
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

rote zora

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #23 on: October 03, 2012, 20:10:36 PM »
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It was WikiLeaks’ revelations and pan-Arab activists, not the Obama administration, that helped to trigger the Arab Spring.

Source: Todays WL press statement

Well, there is no one who can tell this for a fact. For instance, in the case of Syria we learned only later that there were some hidden helpers like Obamas administration financing the opposition as well as the german founded group "The Day After" whose goal was to make a plan for the post-Assad period.

« Last Edit: October 03, 2012, 20:12:09 PM by rote zora »

Offline hedgehog

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #24 on: October 03, 2012, 20:35:40 PM »
Hello!

I would like to (respectfully  :)) disagree with some things that had been said here.

In my opinion, this fundraising campaign is not that WL is becoming a political tool or trying to influence the elections results. They jump into the elections processus in order to protest against the US (government) attacks on them.

Like if, I don't know, a union of workers, farmers, other professions used that period to protest because the government has put to much taxes upon them, just use the electoral period to make hear an angry voice.

I don't think it is especially against Obama, but it is him who was president at the moment of those attacks, so it is him who concentrates the anger.

According to me, the way that WL acts here is a mockery against US political power and not a tentative to access to that power. They don't think seriously that people  would write their name in a ballot.

I am not trying to defend them saying that it is just a joke, it is more than a joke, it is a very big provocation, may be of bad taste, I don't know... But in the same time it is full of impertinence and boldness, and I don't dislike that.

I can be wrong, of course, just my opinion  ;)


Offline Riney

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #25 on: October 03, 2012, 20:48:07 PM »
Thank you hedgehog for the polite reply. All opinions in this discussion are welcome. <3
As I stated earlier on this thread, I have been trying hard to figure all of this bizarre thing out. Each reply has added to my understanding.
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

Offline Pond

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2012, 08:08:18 AM »
@hedgehog thanks, you have rised an interesting point:

Quote
According to me, the way that WL acts here is a mockery against US political power and not a tentative to access to that power. They don't think seriously that people  would write their name in a ballot.

I am not trying to defend them saying that it is just a joke, it is more than a joke, it is a very big provocation, may be of bad taste, I don't know... But in the same time it is full of impertinence and boldness, and I don't dislike that.

Thanks, this is a good point.

It's just that this is what one like me would never have espected from a Journalistic organization.
I think this is now become Political activism... And now yes I'm 100% sure that JA's case is politically motivated because WikiLeaks' actions, "jokes and sense of humor" touch in full the week points of the US politics in this moment.

I'm sure hedgehog that the Main thing for WikiLeaks in this moment is, more than influencing the elections, rising Money for the organization.

I see in this move of connecting the US elections to WL, because of the attacks WL has recived by the actual Obama administration (see Julian Assange's video/speech: it's Completely centred on Obama), a way to rise funds.

But I also see a strong subliminal (or less subliminal) political message behind the Intro-video, that even contradicts the "neutrality" of certain WL tweets.

I's a mix of messages expressed all-together and I think it's hard to distinguish all of them and controlling the emotional reactions toward them put together.

I dare saying this is a pure Strategy of Marketing: playing on the feelings of the Americans and also the non-Americans because the elections are watched, to say "don't mind politics that is dirty stuff, donate to WikiLeaks".

I think this "move" was studied to rise funds, nothingelse.

What I'm criticizing is The Way and The Methods that have been used.

-They don't say "we support human rights (in general), donate WL", they specifically say "don't vote this or that, vote US" (It's a quite confusing message)
-In marketing/pubblicity one single spot can express more than a message; here the main is for sure "donate" but, from the prospective of one that is used to analyze these things, I see another strong sub-message that is "don't vote for anyone (in the US)"
-Analyzing the video of this "campaign" (it must be watched because the Image and the Intro. of this campaign are Strongly influent), one sees all the time Obama, Obama, Obama and his campaign "yes we can" turned against him because of the errors of the Obama administration and only at the end one sees other "ennemies of WL" pointing the finger against JA or WL. This is another sub-sub-message I guess: 1. The Words tell "vote WikiLeaks" with your wallets 2. But the Images, the sounds, the editing of the film clearly say "Obama is a crap, dn't vote Obama".
I see that After WL has tweeted not Obama, not Romney, but WL. But from the analysis of all the elements and mainly of the emotional elements, there is a strong Strong Anti-Obama message!
-Analizing JA's speech it's clear that, as the US has called WL and JA "ennemy of the State", WL is now reacting to the attacks attacking the US its way.
-Also it seems to be done for the injust conditions Bradley manning and the US people are facing... But, sorry, what conditions are for example facing the people in Somalia?! ... I mean that these other messages included in the spots are ok, but to me, in this context, they seem included only to strenghten the emotional impact of the spot.

I hope I don't seem too cinic, but I've been used to analyze what I watch trough the media and in this spot, in the WikiLeaks "fundrasing" (not "election"!! it's "fundraszing"!!) campaign I have seen so many coincidences that it make me think of the same pubblicities used by the corporations to create advertising.

It's a thing I don't like if done by WikiLeaks.
I'll try to explain why.
The method uses multilayer messages.
One of the messages "donate to WL" emerges in full.
The others "don't vote", "don't vote Obama", "we are reacting against the US attacks", "we stand for Bradley M.", "we want to create a change", "we are a new opportunity for the world", etc. [they are many and sometimes contraddictory] don't emerge in full. They emerge by Emotions.
The difference between a  rational message (given by words) and an emotional message (given by the sounds, the images, the editing, the mix of all the elements...) is that they don't pass through the same channel. So if the 1st rational one is something that can be easly percived, controlled, the 2nd emotive is something that passes through the guts and the skin and not everybody is conscious that s/he is reciving and absorbing that message.
Result: it's very easy to understand that this is a fundrasing campaign.
It is not as much easy to deal with the emotional impact THIS kind of fundrasing campaign provocates.
It is set like "sense of humor" and "another opportunity for the citiziens", but Are We Sure that the "Don't Vote Obama" message isn't passing as Serious?

And mainly: is it correct toward supporters that an Organization For The Transparence ["We open governments" is the intro of WikiLeaks on twitter] is using such kind of methods to pubblicize its campaign to rise money? Is it professional? Is it Transparent for everybody? ... How many messages are passing through this "elections/fundrasing campaign" a part from the campaign itself and are we All conscious that we are absorbing them?

Riney, rote zora, sheaton, myself  and I think many others indeed have remarked that they are perciving this like a Political message.

I'm reflecting on the professionality or not of This kind of methods from an org. that it's said to work for transparency. ::)
« Last Edit: October 04, 2012, 08:22:23 AM by TheHamster »

TrxiZ

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2012, 17:25:02 PM »
@hedgehog

Quote
I can be wrong, of course, just my opinion  ;)

no no no.

I just wanna clear one thing.

Everyones Opinion is okay - there is no wrong and right.

there is no black and white.

Offline Pond

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2012, 18:54:05 PM »
T --> well said: whatever opinion is a precious contribute because it gives another prospective of the reality that can extend our views.

---

Ehmm... there is another thing about the campaign's video that is bothering me ;D I must "rant" it here.

Julian Assange:
Quote
I'm Julian Assange and I approve this message

 :o O.O !! ... And I'm The Hamster and I am laughing!  ;D ;D <3! Kidding.

I mean that that part sounds a bit funny as if it was "I'm Queen Elizabeth and I approve" ... Lol.

Seriously now: it is done on purpose because so, all the Assange's supporters are lead to agree with the message; and J. Assange knows he has "charisma" and he has the emotional or rational support of many persons.

I think it's another mean to persuade the persons that:
- The "election campaign" with All its messages is a Right thing
- We have to donate WikiLeaks because Assange asks for this
- We have to support this message also to support Assange or, viceversa, if one is a WL suporter/JA supporter has to agree with this stuff.

It's a Mix, a whole mix. It's confusing. It's making even more hard to separate the Assange's personal events and "charisma" from the organization WikiLeaks and now WikiLeaks from Assange and this campaign.

And I'm laughing because of "Mr charisma" - that has all my support in his right of freedom, political asylum and a fair treatment - But now ...my reaction when one tells me "this is good because I approove it" or sorta is becoming rebel and thinking with my head even if it is the Pope himself ordering me to trust ;D

One should use the charisma to promote free thinking I guess - wich in other speeches instead JA has promoted - but in this video ...  ;D :afro:

« Last Edit: October 04, 2012, 21:05:46 PM by =Z= »

Offline Signhilde

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Re: WikiLeaks launching a US Federal election related campaign?
« Reply #29 on: October 04, 2012, 22:13:44 PM »
This campaign makes even me sad. I have allways looked upon the election day as a festival day. To work for high participation in the election has allways been important. And now this denial... If we believe in Democracy we should ask people to vote. If I had a chance I would support president Obama. He has made mistakes, he has met confrontation. Still I like him and important would be to help him get friends i Congress.
I wonder sometimes if WL is a democratic organisation (sorry). Wikileaks-forum is a good thing anyway!
2014 will we have elections in Sweden, will WL take part? :-\