Author Topic: Greetings and salutations.  (Read 7416 times)

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Offline pathios

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Greetings and salutations.
« on: October 17, 2012, 08:52:12 AM »
Hiya everyone,

As you may or may not know.... I am the new site owner. Z after many years of dedicated service had decided to retire from public life and from being the administrator of this forum. I would like to introduce myself as the new face and the new site owner.

I have a lot of exciting plans for the future of WLF and these include (but are not limited to) broadening the scope of the forum and creating a constitution to give us structure. I think most of you will love the changes I will bring in, and I am hoping these changes I bring in will be more inclusive and offer more value to our website visitors.

I come with over a decade of hosting experience and also have experience in working with grass roots organizations.  I hope I can use this experience to grow our forum.

Please watch this space as event unfold.

YIF (Yours in Freedom),
Pathios.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2012, 08:53:44 AM by pathios »
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.

Flavia

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2012, 08:47:37 AM »
hi to you pathios!  :)
congratulations for your new job!
you have a reputation-score of 23 out of 29 posts, so I guess you'll be a good boss  :laugh:

Offline pathios

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2012, 09:08:13 AM »
Thanks for that. I will work hard to try grow this forum. The day to day running of this forum will still fall to the mods and admins you all know. I will be offering suggestions where I can, but in the end I have decided on a democratic method of management, so the admins and mods kinda vote and decide on everything.
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.

Offline LatviaFoWL

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2012, 10:39:45 AM »
You are very welcome! :)
LatviaFoWL

Offline pathios

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2012, 12:22:50 PM »
Thanks LatviaFoWL. I know a lot of people are not happy with me, especially considering my personal opinions on Julian.. I make a terrible fan-club groupie. I have independent moderate thought and that upsets the fanatics. My personal views will not impact the running of the forum. I have already changed decision voting amongst admins and moderates to be democratic.

Needless to say I will be working hard with the people here to make sure this forum stays up and is a legacy we leave behind.
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.

Offline LatviaFoWL

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2012, 13:23:18 PM »
Interesting... because I don't know your personal opinions on Julian. Anyway, I'm glad that the wikileaks-forum ir back online.
LatviaFoWL

Offline pathios

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2012, 13:44:07 PM »
Im sure you well soon.

I was a pretty big supporter back in the early days but over time I was disillusioned with the totalitarian method of running WL. Im a democratic kinda person. I believe in accountability and transparency. Or as Julian's mom would call it, " a lefty game". So I am not popular there. I believe in the ideals of Wikileaks strongly though... and even though I may not personally agree with the way the Assange`s are running their campaign. I will support the ideal. I believe the ideal is more important than one man or one site.

It is the natural state of information to be free :)

I am decentralizing power in this forum to make it democratic. So it outlasts the individual. I am pretty sure over the next couple of weeks the trolls are going to drooling at the mouths as they climb into me and my character. I expect nothing less from them. Just in my case.... I dont care. They can insult and attack me all they want.  Im here to get a job done. Make sure the forum stays up. Im not here to win a popularity contest.


« Last Edit: October 18, 2012, 13:47:38 PM by pathios »
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.

Offline LatviaFoWL

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2012, 16:32:09 PM »
I look on this from a different point of view. This situation is a big test for all of us which separates Julian's and WL supporters from just the WikiLeaks users.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2012, 16:40:18 PM by LatviaFoWL »
LatviaFoWL

enrica

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2012, 17:14:55 PM »
Great you are with us Pathios :) ^^

---

Yes I think this is an important moment.
I think This is the place where Many different points of view on WikiLeaks and also other topics can come out and meet each other.
There are really Many kind of views.
Here they will be all respected and listened.
The only obvious limit are the guidelines, created to mantain this a nice place where everyone can feel welcome without being attacked.

There are persons supporting whatever decision/move of WikiLeaks & Assange, persons that don't like WikiLeaks and its "people" at all, persons that have doubts, persons that support but would also like to express criticism toward certain topics... No Mind or Point of view is Identical to another.

As this is a Forum, this is the place for All the points of view.

It is Not support vs non-support.
It is 1idea+1idea+1idea+... Where the collective of ideas and opinions, shared together, can give everyone of us More than "my idea only".
Creative and Constructive debate can really produce Growth.
For everyone the developements will be different, as we are All different; and here stays the Fun, together and different  :afro:

Offline pathios

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2012, 18:17:47 PM »
I think I will highlight the most important sentence in that great post above:

As this is a Forum, this is the place for All the points of view.
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.

Offline Riney

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2012, 19:46:37 PM »
     I am glad that you reiterated that point. I personally do not feel that it can be reiterated too much.

      In the current twitter shouting match climate, while so many dramatic things are going on with WikiLeaks, it has certainly been an ongoing struggle for this forum to weather the storm of backlash that came after it started to allow opposing views of JA and/or WL issues.

       You would not believe how many times that the point you just reiterated had to be argued to people, really it was so strange to see very ardent supporters of Assange attack others for expressing any negative opinions about the man. It was as if freedom of speech existed only for those that spoke highly of him.   
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

Offline LatviaFoWL

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2012, 08:56:15 AM »
Pathios,  you said: "I believe in the ideals of Wikileaks strongly though...". Who do you think created those ideals? Please, call the name of that person.
LatviaFoWL

Offline Riney

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2012, 11:11:13 AM »
Hi LatviaFoWL,

           If you mean the "Ideals of WikiLeaks" pertaining to the concept of WikiLeaks itself, that is an issue of debate. There are people that claim that they conceived the idea WikiLeaks along with Julian Assange and I have heard at least one person say they were the one that conceived it before him for WikiLeaks. All in all, Julian Assange himself has in the past, referred to himself as the cofounder of WikiLeaks, not the main founder.

          If you mean the "ideals of WikiLeaks" pertaining to freedom of information or speech in general, there certainly is no one person that created those ideas. Those ideas existed long before WikiLeaks was formed. 
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage" Anais Nin .. and yet we must arm ourselves with fear

Offline LatviaFoWL

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2012, 16:04:56 PM »
Dear Pathios,

Have you ever read this WikiLeaks material: "Bank of America using Private Intel Firms to Attack WikiLeaks" on http://wikileaks.org/ ?
Inter alia, this document describes WikiLeaks strengths and weaknesses.

=====
"Strengths
Their strength is their global following and volunteer staff. This allows them to have a very loose organization. Little if any direction or coordination is actually passed it is just inferred as part of the cause.
Julien pronounces and the minions follow. Larger infrastructure is fairly pointless to attack because they have so many other points and organizations that are willing to distribute the information and help them get new hosting services.

Weaknesses
Financial: They are under increasing financial pressure because authorities are blocking their funding sources.
Security: Need to get to the Swedish document submission server. Need to create doubt about their security and increase awareness that interaction with WikiLeaks will expose you.
Mission: There is a fracture among the followers because of a belief that Julien is going astray from cause and selected his own mission of attacking the US.

Despite the publicity, WikiLeaks is NOT in a healthy position right now. Their weakness  are causing great stress in the organization which can be capitalized on."
=====

How do you think, dear Pathios, are you actually helping to WikiLeaks or weakening this organization by NOT supporting Julian?
« Last Edit: October 23, 2012, 16:10:05 PM by LatviaFoWL »
LatviaFoWL

Offline pathios

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Re: Greetings and salutations.
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2012, 16:29:07 PM »
Dear Pathios,

Have you ever read this WikiLeaks material: "Bank of America using Private Intel Firms to Attack WikiLeaks" on http://wikileaks.org/ ?
Inter alia, this document describes WikiLeaks strengths and weaknesses.

=====
"Strengths
Their strength is their global following and volunteer staff. This allows them to have a very loose organization. Little if any direction or coordination is actually passed it is just inferred as part of the cause.
Julien pronounces and the minions follow. Larger infrastructure is fairly pointless to attack because they have so many other points and organizations that are willing to distribute the information and help them get new hosting services.

Weaknesses
Financial: They are under increasing financial pressure because authorities are blocking their funding sources.
Security: Need to get to the Swedish document submission server. Need to create doubt about their security and increase awareness that interaction with WikiLeaks will expose you.
Mission: There is a fracture among the followers because of a belief that Julien is going astray from cause and selected his own mission of attacking the US.

Despite the publicity, WikiLeaks is NOT in a healthy position right now. Their weakness  are causing great stress in the organization which can be capitalized on."
=====

How do you think, dear Pathios, are you actually helping to WikiLeaks or weakening this organization by NOT supporting Julian?

Hiya,

Thanks for your post.  I have clarified myself several times on this, but let me try again. The ideal is bigger than one person. If you dont make the ideal bigger than one person, then one person has the ability to destroy the ideal.

A very simple analogy is I can support my favourite sports team without having to like the coach. I can create websites about my favourite sports team without having to like the coach. I can give money to my favourite sports team without having to like the coach. Why? Because the whole is more important than one personality.

I can easily support Wikileaks without having to fully support everything Julian does. This forum is a perfect example of this. While I may no longer donate to Julian (at least not until there is transparent accounting setup so I know how the money is being spent). I have dedicated time and resources to keep this forum up. My personal opinion  of Julian is irrelevant. So by keeping this forum up, I am still supporting Wikileaks.

Listen, I am not totally against Julian, its just I work differently. I believe in democracy. I believe in accountability and transparency. Is Wikileaks the organization a democracy or a totalitarian institute? I once asked Julian a long time ago to please show me how the money being donated is being spent. He has never said a word about it. Until he creates proper institutional structure and has transparent accounting in place (like all the other causes I donate money to have in place). I simply dont know how it is being spent. I cant just change basic principles I expect from an institution simply based on an individuals popularity.

That aside. I can still do my bit by talking about Wikileaks and the LEAKS. I can still support the ideal by keeping the forum going. I dont need to sit at a dinner table discussing Julian with people. I can simply get to the real important data that are the leaks.

Another way to look at this. If Julian is fully discredited with convincing evidence (not that this will happen, I am speaking hypothetically here). How will my involvement with WL continue? Same way as it does now. I am focused on the ideal, not an individual. But for many many other supporters, because their ideal is based on the personality. WL will stop for them.

My personal opinion is Wikileaks could become more powerful if there was better structure and there was not one man running the whole show and it was correctly structured to outlast him.

I hope that answers your question.

I also want to add, that I have been supporting Wikileaks since before I knew who Julian really was, and before they even released their first leaks. Going through my Gmail I see when I was first signed up to their support base:

Quote
SYMPA [email protected]
1/13/07
Reply
to pathios
Someone (hopefully you) asked for your e-mail address
to be added to list 'wikileaks'.
If you want this action to be taken, please

- reply to this mail
OR
- send a message to [email protected] with subject
 auth XXXXXXX subscribe wikileaks
OR
- hit the following mailto mailto:[email protected]

If you do not want this action to be taken, you can safely ignore
this message.

How long have you been supporting the ideal?
« Last Edit: October 23, 2012, 16:39:12 PM by pathios »
Democracy is a privilege. You dont use it you lose it.